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	<title>Comments on: Got a website, now for a web team…</title>
	<link>http://www.underthenavbar.com/wp/posts/2007/06/18/got-a-website-now-for-a-web-team/</link>
	<description>advice on managing websites and web teams</description>
	<pubDate>Sat, 22 Nov 2008 03:51:45 +0000</pubDate>
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		<title>By: Lucy</title>
		<link>http://www.underthenavbar.com/wp/posts/2007/06/18/got-a-website-now-for-a-web-team/#comment-5</link>
		<author>Lucy</author>
		<pubDate>Mon, 25 Jun 2007 19:18:36 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid>http://www.underthenavbar.com/wp/posts/2007/06/18/got-a-website-now-for-a-web-team/#comment-5</guid>
		<description>&lt;p&gt;Hi Michael&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;Thanks for the encouragement.  I think you've hit the nail on the head with what I've been feeling lately.  I've been involved with a number of organisations and they all battle with similar issues - where does web sit, what skills do you need, what should we be doing, how do we work with the rest of the business and how can we show the rest of the business what is and isn't possible on the web.  &lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;The list of issues goes on and I'm not entirely sure how many satisfactory answers are out there.&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;As far as I can see most web teams grow organically but are often stuck battling with the fall out from decisions made 5 to 10 years ago.  Battling with decisions about organisational structure and ownership made when the web was in its infancy.  &lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;I think one of the key things to know is what an organisation wants out of its website.  Then you can have a look at how achieveable that is within your current structure.  But until you've got that far, there's little you'll be able to do to unite stakeholders and actually push for change.&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;Lucy&lt;/p&gt;
</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Hi Michael</p>
<p>Thanks for the encouragement.  I think you&#8217;ve hit the nail on the head with what I&#8217;ve been feeling lately.  I&#8217;ve been involved with a number of organisations and they all battle with similar issues - where does web sit, what skills do you need, what should we be doing, how do we work with the rest of the business and how can we show the rest of the business what is and isn&#8217;t possible on the web.  </p>
<p>The list of issues goes on and I&#8217;m not entirely sure how many satisfactory answers are out there.</p>
<p>As far as I can see most web teams grow organically but are often stuck battling with the fall out from decisions made 5 to 10 years ago.  Battling with decisions about organisational structure and ownership made when the web was in its infancy.  </p>
<p>I think one of the key things to know is what an organisation wants out of its website.  Then you can have a look at how achieveable that is within your current structure.  But until you&#8217;ve got that far, there&#8217;s little you&#8217;ll be able to do to unite stakeholders and actually push for change.</p>
<p>Lucy</p>
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		<title>By: Michael</title>
		<link>http://www.underthenavbar.com/wp/posts/2007/06/18/got-a-website-now-for-a-web-team/#comment-4</link>
		<author>Michael</author>
		<pubDate>Mon, 25 Jun 2007 14:45:34 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid>http://www.underthenavbar.com/wp/posts/2007/06/18/got-a-website-now-for-a-web-team/#comment-4</guid>
		<description>Lucy,

I'm glad you've stepped up to fill a glaring need for a blog focusing on the team aspect of Web development. There are a thousand blogs on what the individual does or should do and high-level discourse on what the Web is and isn't, but I think a lot of us are clamoring for a discussion of how the individuals should work together and how a team should be structured. At my company, our biggest challenge is the interaction between the parts that make the Web team, as well as the Web team's interaction with the rest of the company. This stuff requires thinking beyond code and design.

Michael</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Lucy,</p>
<p>I&#8217;m glad you&#8217;ve stepped up to fill a glaring need for a blog focusing on the team aspect of Web development. There are a thousand blogs on what the individual does or should do and high-level discourse on what the Web is and isn&#8217;t, but I think a lot of us are clamoring for a discussion of how the individuals should work together and how a team should be structured. At my company, our biggest challenge is the interaction between the parts that make the Web team, as well as the Web team&#8217;s interaction with the rest of the company. This stuff requires thinking beyond code and design.</p>
<p>Michael</p>
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		<title>By: Lucy</title>
		<link>http://www.underthenavbar.com/wp/posts/2007/06/18/got-a-website-now-for-a-web-team/#comment-3</link>
		<author>Lucy</author>
		<pubDate>Thu, 21 Jun 2007 17:01:36 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid>http://www.underthenavbar.com/wp/posts/2007/06/18/got-a-website-now-for-a-web-team/#comment-3</guid>
		<description>&lt;p&gt;DJ, I take your point, and yes there are still a lot of people who really don't "get it".  And perhaps this blog *can* help (eek!). ;-)&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;But I'm not so sure that we need to worry about who the teachers are - as long as debate and discussion are fostered then hopefully the teachers' skills will not be as important as the students' attitudes. &lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;I wonder how static the industry really has been over the last decade.  Certainly Jakob's article paints a sorry picture, but I suspect it's not the full story.  &lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;My guess is the level of sophistication at the top end has improved dramatically and it's the majority who have stayed in the same place.  Yet I'd expect the majority to rapidly catch up as more people do more business online, and more people "get it".  Sort of in a drip drip whoosh kind of way.&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;Lucy&lt;/p&gt;
</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>DJ, I take your point, and yes there are still a lot of people who really don&#8217;t &#8220;get it&#8221;.  And perhaps this blog *can* help (eek!). ;-)</p>
<p>But I&#8217;m not so sure that we need to worry about who the teachers are - as long as debate and discussion are fostered then hopefully the teachers&#8217; skills will not be as important as the students&#8217; attitudes. </p>
<p>I wonder how static the industry really has been over the last decade.  Certainly Jakob&#8217;s article paints a sorry picture, but I suspect it&#8217;s not the full story.  </p>
<p>My guess is the level of sophistication at the top end has improved dramatically and it&#8217;s the majority who have stayed in the same place.  Yet I&#8217;d expect the majority to rapidly catch up as more people do more business online, and more people &#8220;get it&#8221;.  Sort of in a drip drip whoosh kind of way.</p>
<p>Lucy</p>
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		<title>By: DJ</title>
		<link>http://www.underthenavbar.com/wp/posts/2007/06/18/got-a-website-now-for-a-web-team/#comment-2</link>
		<author>DJ</author>
		<pubDate>Wed, 20 Jun 2007 19:07:28 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid>http://www.underthenavbar.com/wp/posts/2007/06/18/got-a-website-now-for-a-web-team/#comment-2</guid>
		<description>Hi Lucy

Of course I would like to take issue with a number of points you raise !!

&lt;blockquote&gt;There is also a large range of skills on the market, but thankfully the number of cowboys is reducing.&lt;/blockquote&gt;
I disagree. You're right in the sense that on one hand the bar is being raised significantly by people understanding the potential of the web, the advent of larger broadband penetration and the general acceptance of web standards, usability and accessibility.

However on the other you only have to point out the sheer volume of people who are doing this work now to understand that eradicating the cowboys is a dumb goal ;o) 3 years after I left college (1994 since you ask!) we worked out that over 30,000 graduates were coming out of Media Studies and Art &#38; Design degrees interested in getting into what we called at the time "Multimedia". Nowadays you can get degrees in all sorts around the topic. This is all good but begs the question - who is teaching these people? 

With the standard of usability online not being *dramatically* higher than 10 years ago (come on Jakob back me up: http://www.useit.com/alertbox/guidelines-change.html) there is still a gap in the market for people who know what they are doing, can manage projects effectively and explain what they do to others.

Hence the need for your site, you could argue.

Will enjoy clocking in every now and again !

DJ</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Hi Lucy</p>
<p>Of course I would like to take issue with a number of points you raise !!</p>
<blockquote><p>There is also a large range of skills on the market, but thankfully the number of cowboys is reducing.</p></blockquote>
<p>I disagree. You&#8217;re right in the sense that on one hand the bar is being raised significantly by people understanding the potential of the web, the advent of larger broadband penetration and the general acceptance of web standards, usability and accessibility.</p>
<p>However on the other you only have to point out the sheer volume of people who are doing this work now to understand that eradicating the cowboys is a dumb goal ;o) 3 years after I left college (1994 since you ask!) we worked out that over 30,000 graduates were coming out of Media Studies and Art &amp; Design degrees interested in getting into what we called at the time &#8220;Multimedia&#8221;. Nowadays you can get degrees in all sorts around the topic. This is all good but begs the question - who is teaching these people? </p>
<p>With the standard of usability online not being *dramatically* higher than 10 years ago (come on Jakob back me up: <a href="http://www.useit.com/alertbox/guidelines-change.html" rel="nofollow">http://www.useit.com/alertbox/.....hange.html</a>) there is still a gap in the market for people who know what they are doing, can manage projects effectively and explain what they do to others.</p>
<p>Hence the need for your site, you could argue.</p>
<p>Will enjoy clocking in every now and again !</p>
<p>DJ</p>
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